Will Billy Lyell upset Chavez Jr?

http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?cat=boxer&human_id=200386

Odds
Lyell +1750
Chavez Jr -3500

Lyell beat John Duddy before Chumpez did

I am going to say no, Wild Card sparring will do wonders for Chumpez.

Ali wrote:I am going to say no, Wild Card sparring will do wonders for Chumpez.

He hasnt done that, why Roach is in Mexico

gomez1012 wrote:

Ali wrote:I am going to say no, Wild Card sparring will do wonders for Chumpez.

He hasnt done that, why Roach is in Mexico

Not for this camp but Chavez did spar there last year. Plus Jr's got Alex Ariza now working on a strength and conditioning program for him.

I could just the see upset

Canceled fight w/Fonso Gomez, the flu, weight issues, lazy fighter, had to fly Roach out to train him

Who's going to be watching?

I got my dvr set for this as well



http://www.fightnews.com/Boxing/chavez-jr-lyell-make-weight-73836

Hobbitt FTW!

Lyell is a journeyman. Only claim to fame is beating Duddy. He lost to James Kirkland. Lost to Yuri Boy Campas. Vanes beat him. Sylvester KO'd. Lost to some fellow journeyman. Chavez Jr. won't lose to this guy.

captainanddew wrote:Lyell is a journeyman. Only claim to fame is beating Duddy. He lost to James Kirkland. Lost to Yuri Boy Campas. Vanes beat him. Sylvester KO'd. Lost to some fellow journeyman. Chavez Jr. won't lose to this guy.

Chavez Jr had his share of troubles vs Duddy and looked bad against worse opponents than the Hobbitt

its on Top Rank Live, Ill be rooting for him

Chavez will walk it with ease. I think people are still downplaying the fact that Chavez is half decent.

kebark wrote:Chavez will walk it with ease. I think people are still downplaying the fact that Chavez is half decent.

Based on what? Beating John Duddy???

gomez1012 wrote:

kebark wrote:Chavez will walk it with ease. I think people are still downplaying the fact that Chavez is half decent.

Based on what? Beating John Duddy???

The fact that he has decent movement, decent handspeed and decent skills. People talk about him as if he's a total bum. He's not great but he's a lot better than people seem to want to give him credit for being.

Ive seen progress and he is what he is

a club fighter

He might be a strap holder because they are so damn many around these days, but he'll get smoked the first time he steps up or faces anyone with decent pop

kebark it is impossible to judge whether or not he's even half decent, since he hasn't fought a single good opponent. Not even B-level oppoents.

It is impossible to judge how good a fighter is until get a proper measurment with compition.

Shit, Sam Peter looked like a beat when was knocking out bums. Soon he stepped up, he's sucked ever since

GrantZilla wrote:kebark it is impossible to judge whether or not he's even half decent, since he hasn't fought a single good opponent. Not even B-level oppoents.

It is impossible to judge how good a fighter is until get a proper measurment with compition.

Shit, Sam Peter looked like a beat when was knocking out bums. Soon he stepped up, he's sucked ever since

It's not impossible per se, it's just difficult. Though we know he's better than the C level fighters like Duddy. We don't know how good he is, but we know that he's not as bad as Duddy. It's that many seem to talk about him as if he's a journeyman when he's a step above. Yes his record is padded, yes he's been lucky, but he's faced a few semi decent fighters and done well against them. Duddy is the obvious one, whilst victories (close or not) against Vanda (the rematch certainly) and Cuello are nice wins.

I'm not calling him great, I'm just saying people are harsher on him than they need to be. The kid isn't his dad, and he isn't a legend but he's also not a complete bum. Peter, when he was fit, didn't suck, he dropped Wlad a fair few times, become a world title holder then let it go to his head and mentally imploded.

Peter isn't a bum, but he's a C-level opponent at best. He got a trinket by beating a totaly shot Maskaev, who went on and got KO'd by Nagy Aguilera. So that means abosolutly nothing. Especialy considering he almost got KO'd by Jameel McCline.

His knockdowns of Wlad were illegal rabbit punches. That's why Wlad was able to survive them.

B-level HW I'd say is Chageav, Thompsons, Povetkins of the division.

As for JCC Jr. Is he a bum? No. He's a slight notch above that, and nothing else until beats even B-level opponent.

GrantZilla wrote:Peter isn't a bum, but he's a C-level opponent at best. He got a trinket by beating a totaly shot Maskaev, who went on and got KO'd by Nagy Aguilera. So that means abosolutly nothing. Especialy considering he almost got KO'd by Jameel McCline.

His knockdowns of Wlad were illegal rabbit punches. That's why Wlad was able to survive them.

As for JCC Jr. Is he a bum? No. He's a slight notch above that, and nothing else until beats even B-level opponent.

I'd agree with Peter being C- level, B- on his best days (Toney II). Though my entire point is that people are over-critical of Chavez Jr, he's maybe himself on a C class fighter, but people talk about him as if he's really crap. It's the fact that in the eyes of many you're either a top guy or your rubbish. There never appears any middle ground which is odd as most fighters fit in the middle ground.

Cuello got smoked by Canelo!!!


Matt Vanda beat Chumpez the first time, and if he's considered a good win...just WOW

Ill watch him fight, but to classify Jr as a journeyman

Yes Canelo smoked him, but Canelo is a very good fighter with power.

kebark you know what JCC Jr get's the critisim, and it's fair.

He's running off of nothing but his daddies name. He's on PPVs and making good money, when his ass would barely be telivised on FNF if he was anyone else.

That's just a fact. If he ever wanted to get on Showbox, he'd had to have fought much beter comp to get them interested.

He sure and fuck wouldn't be headlining PPVs facing bums.

He has earned nothing to justify his status. Shit, we wouldn't even be talking about him if he was anyone else.

GrantZilla wrote:kebark you know what JCC Jr get's the critisim, and it's fair.

He's running off of nothing but his daddies name. He's on PPVs and making good money, when his ass would barely be telivised on FNF if he was anyone else.

That's just a fact. If he ever wanted to get on Showbox, he'd had to have fought much beter comp to get them interested.

He sure and fuck wouldn't be headlining PPVs facing bums.

He has earned nothing to justify his status. Shit, we wouldn't even be talking about him if he was anyone else.

I agree with that, but people are treating him as if he's an out and out loser. He's limited, but a middle of the order type of fighter. Give him a fight or two, I have a feeling he'll grow into a semi decent fighter. But to call him a journeyman due to the fact he's able to live off daddy's name and get nice money is a bit harsh.

Yeah, it's harsh, but I think justified. Until he proves otherwise. So far. He has not.

If he beats a B-level opponent, he'll start getting some grumblings of praise. If he beats a A-level opponent, he will get his props.

As it stands, the WBC are practicaly handing him Martinez's belt without even fighting him. You know damn well it's him and his daddy that pushed for this from Don Jose.

It's a disgrace. I have no respect for JCC Jr as of now. Fuck him and his daddy

Chavez had virtually no amateur experience so it's now wonder he's been brought along at a snails pace.