It saddens me to see such a legend age

It happens to us all I know but man Ali was such a god in his prime

I stand by my statement Ali's condition has harmed boxing more than anything. Past greats that were loved by millions and suffered from the same condition were not as publisized. It was hidden by their families and a more sympathetic media.

I just think it's sad that Ali is wheeled out in public for money, my 84 year old grandfather is in much better shape than he is, just goes to show the price so many fighters have paid.

GrantZilla wrote:I stand by my statement Ali's condition has harmed boxing more than anything. Past greats that were loved by millions and suffered from the same condition were not as publisized. It was hidden by their families and a more sympathetic media.

...i have mixed feelings on this with ali.part of it has to be with the cruelity he delt verbally to others and when told about it ali didnt care that feelings inside of that other person were genuinely hurt bad .he kept it up with thoses folks.he simply didnt care.
yes as grant said several great and good fighters died with severe inflictions greater then alis.ez charles wheel chair bound and almost helpless.jerry quarry died i think not sure in a nursing home at the age of maybe early 50s.dementia brought on by fighting where jerry litterly had no mind left.

Karma is a bitch.

i didnt mind ali's tactics (although i wasnt around during that time). his tactics actually brought a ton to boxing. they were good for the sport. he grabbed the attention of the whole entire world. that was his life though and that is where it brought him.

Soonermark890 wrote:Karma is a bitch.

So Ali talks some trash and ends up confined to a wheelchair. Seems like a fair trade

-lets just throw out the karma issue
-lets throw out the health issues that ali has that make him look feeble


just in general:
-you can't beat father time
-with athletes we see them between ages of say 20 and 35 normally. most of them disappear and then we see them every so often.
-When you see someone that your brain remembers in their 20s or 30s, at age 60, it is shocking. There is so much change to digest. You feel sad that they are old.
-with actors that I remember being young that are now old, I don't have the same reaction. you see an actor from the time he is in his late 20s and he is in his late 50s now. If he has been acting regularly, then you have seen him. You are accustomed to the change.

If you had seen Tom Hanks when he was on busom buddies, splash, and big (big was 1988 I think) and then hadn't seen him till 2012 (24 yrs) then you would remark how much he had aged. While Mr. Hanks doesn't look like a spring chicken, when i see him in a movie now I am not shocked. I've seen him throughout the past 25 years. My brain isn't only seeing him as the young guy from Big.

Beautiful person and the greatest fighter of all times. My take.

Frank wrote:Beautiful person and the greatest fighter of all times. My take.

we are in the minority of boxing fans referring to the bold part.

powerpuncher wrote:

Frank wrote:Beautiful person and the greatest fighter of all times. My take.

we are in the minority of boxing fans referring to the bold part.

Everyone's entitled to their opinion.

As far as the person is concerned, I see Ali's struggle with Parkinsons as an inspiration.

His will to live is incredible. He's not hiding himself. Ali is taking on the disease to the best of his ability. He's showing another part of his amazing courage and heart. God bless him.

powerpuncher wrote:

Frank wrote:Beautiful person and the greatest fighter of all times. My take.

we are in the minority of boxing fans referring to the bold part.

...ill agree with powerpuncher on that..in fact maybe the whole statement is of a minority opinion.

powerpuncher wrote:i didnt mind ali's tactics (although i wasnt around during that time). his tactics actually brought a ton to boxing. they were good for the sport. he grabbed the attention of the whole entire world. that was his life though and that is where it brought him.

+1

I think that those fans who have a problem with Ali should look at the end caption in my fav movie, "Raging Bull." It read, "All I know is before I was blind, and now I can see." (I obviously forgot the whole quote but you get the message.)

I can't rewrite history for anyone. I've given my opinon on Muhammad Ali as I always do. I also respect the opinions of others and can easily understand how they feel that way.

Ali wrote:

powerpuncher wrote:i didnt mind ali's tactics (although i wasnt around during that time). his tactics actually brought a ton to boxing. they were good for the sport. he grabbed the attention of the whole entire world. that was his life though and that is where it brought him.

+1

I'm 35. I wasn't around for Ali's fights with frazier. from everything I've read, the tactics were not necessary. There are fights you have to sell and fights you don't have to sell.

kbyte wrote:

Soonermark890 wrote:Karma is a bitch.

So Ali talks some trash and ends up confined to a wheelchair. Seems like a fair trade

Oh and he dodged the draft at the same time constantly bad mouthing the USA. You know the country that made him rich. Then he called one of America's Hero's an uncle tom. Then he kept on acting like a piece of shit the rest of his life. Like I said Karma is a bitch.

Frank wrote:I think that those fans who have a problem with Ali should look at the end caption in my fav movie, "Raging Bull." It read, "All I know is before I was blind, and now I can see." (I obviously forgot the whole quote but you get the message.)

I can't rewrite history for anyone. I've given my opinon on Muhammad Ali as I always do. I also respect the opinions of others and can easily understand how they feel that way.

I respect the boxer massively but not the man.

Soonermark890 wrote:

Frank wrote:I think that those fans who have a problem with Ali should look at the end caption in my fav movie, "Raging Bull." It read, "All I know is before I was blind, and now I can see." (I obviously forgot the whole quote but you get the message.)

I can't rewrite history for anyone. I've given my opinon on Muhammad Ali as I always do. I also respect the opinions of others and can easily understand how they feel that way.

I respect the boxer massively but not the man.

Sooner, in Louisville, Kentucky, a black man was not allowed to look a white man in the eye without getting lynched. This formed a large part of Ali's persona. After winning the gold medal, he tried to eat at an all white restaurant. The waiter stated that they didn't serve niggers. Ali stated, "Well I don't eat em either. I want a hamburger."

i was around indeed during alis time.there are things you cant justify in alis case.like sooner i respect greatly ali the fighter.as a man or hero there making him out to be or the honor bestowed upon him with reverence over the years should of been given to others who deserved it.i stated in the begining i have mixed emotions on alis ageing thing topic.since frank wants to justify alis actions fine.i most certainly wasnt blind at any time in my life.nor am i a racist bigot that fails to understand the plight of predudice in any form.
ali did things not to sell a fight but to sell himself as the greatest promotion ever in boxing history and cruely at the expense of others and it wasnt just joe frazier.1.he publicaly humilated joe louis on 3 occasions i can think of in front of louis.joe with the class grace and style he had avoided controversy and didnt feed alis ego.2.he hurt deeply some people with his comments and when told instantly went on insulting people.he couldnt care less about folks feelings at all.promote ali at any expence.3. he indeed avoided and dodge the draft..ali is an intelligent guy.ive seen him in tons of interviews before his draft came up and several after threw the years.i enjoyed many of them when he talked on a serious nature on things and he used his charm humor and wit with expertise...this intelligent guy flunked the mental test hoping for a 4 F to avoid the draft.yes thats right.smart intelligent enough to fail the test on purpose.
the draft folks were not that stupid..after he realized that didnt work he passed the test then said with his lawyers bullshit that he was a consientious objecter.lol yes a fighter using that excuise.of course he wasnt.that and his claim of his so called religious beliefs and his lawyers got ali out of the army..
this was a time the nation was at great divide over the war as well as civil rights movements to protest and change the injustice that were occuring.ali i do believe was indeed against the war but try to avoid it with the above 2 reasons.much to his credit he was willing to risk everything including jail on this..look some kids went to canada to avoid it.0others who were against the war did go and serve and fight also.
civil rights had great leaders like dr king jackie robinson joe louis before yes joe louis that uncle tom per ali.ali took the stance of divide hated and reverse predudice in his so called effort.dr king succeeded but it cost him his life.
ali claims yes he CLAIMS he tossed his olympic medal into a river after the resteraunt thing.realy.so the olimpic commitee years later gave him another after he disrespected that honor..then the gall of letting him hold the tourch at the games is one thing i hated and still do.who the fuck is he to be honored yet they cant find time to give honor and rememberence to the jewish 12 athelits that were brutaly murdered at the games.
ali came at the right time for self promotion at any expense to others and he knew it.he used that divsion in the nation to promote ali the anti-hero amoung young folks .
ive seen several interviews where ali used his venom hatred towards white people to promote the ali image as the greatest because of that divide in the nation.he did shit to heal.he did the opposite.
does anyone actualy believe that so called resteraunt thing ali claims happened was the first time ali or any black poerson in kentucky experienced predudice.
the nation yes indeed has had injustice for years of one sort or another and the blacks didnt have an exclusive on that nor elsewhere in worldhistory threw the years.ican go on and on about deep hatred and predudice ive personaly experienced in life or how italians then the jews in numbers threwout history were slaves alsoand in .bigger numbers.
i can go on and on how ali badmouthed this nation with hatred used the division to promote himself.that was alis true first and most important cause.
i was young then and i can tell you yes ali had fans.made a lot of young folks fans.i was one of them up untill the begining of the second liston fight.i saw threw him.the cruelity the lack of respect towards anyone for his own gain.he was more hated then liked..he still is today.folks are just silent on that.
i can go on and on how our boys came back wounded without a arm or leg or fucked up mentaly or just plain dead and how ali mocked them.how he used the greatest shill ever in howard cossell and others to promote his greatness.
if you want to knell at the altar of ali as a fighter fine.i wont..ill like sooner respect him greatly as a fighter.as a great man.give me a fucking break.and i can see with clear eyes.not blind frank..there are fighgters ill respect as a man.a dam good man faults and all.barney ross is one.joe louis another for example.

Dmar, I hear all your points and respect them.

Frank wrote:

Soonermark890 wrote:

Frank wrote:I think that those fans who have a problem with Ali should look at the end caption in my fav movie, "Raging Bull." It read, "All I know is before I was blind, and now I can see." (I obviously forgot the whole quote but you get the message.)

I can't rewrite history for anyone. I've given my opinon on Muhammad Ali as I always do. I also respect the opinions of others and can easily understand how they feel that way.

I respect the boxer massively but not the man.

Sooner, in Louisville, Kentucky, a black man was not allowed to look a white man in the eye without getting lynched. This formed a large part of Ali's persona. After winning the gold medal, he tried to eat at an all white restaurant. The waiter stated that they didn't serve niggers. Ali stated, "Well I don't eat em either. I want a hamburger."

I understand racism. Hell most of my family has experienced it. But that doesnt excuse him from his behavior either way.

Frank wrote:

powerpuncher wrote:

Frank wrote:Beautiful person and the greatest fighter of all times. My take.

we are in the minority of boxing fans referring to the bold part.

Everyone's entitled to their opinion.

As far as the person is concerned, I see Ali's struggle with Parkinsons as an inspiration.

His will to live is incredible. He's not hiding himself. Ali is taking on the disease to the best of his ability. He's showing another part of his amazing courage and heart. God bless him.

..frank in life you play the cards your delt the best you can.i see it daily and most people play thoses cards well.micheal j foxx is an example also if you want to use ali how he fought for stem cell research etc etc..courage heart.maybe.i dont know for sure.i can only go by personal experience.14 years ago when my wife was terminal how her possitive attitude was always there.how she tried to prepare my younger son for life in the future.how there was no fear for the inevinable..every 2 weeks i go to the doctors for lab work etc etc.in that office are seated several folks with a terminal illness yet they smile enjoy life tell of there experiences of what they did for the week etc etc.amazing courage and heart.im not that sure thats the case.possitive attitude and acceptance of the cards your delt and playing thoses cards to the best of your abilty.yes.im sure of that.there are millions of folks in the usa and elsewhere that display that great attitude and perhaps inner strenth.ali is no differnt then them.

thanks frank.

Yeah Dmar plenty of people have experienced racism. My grandmother experienced a lot of it growing up in the south as a native american. Dont anyone think that racism was only against African Americans. But what makes you a good man is what you do in the face of that adversity and to me Ali did exactly what you shouldnt.