Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

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Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  Shaun on Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:11 am

16 fights vs top tier opposition... and counting.

Erik Morales
Erik Morales II
Erik Morales III
Barrera I
Barrera II
Oscar
Hatton
Cotto
Clottey
Margarito
Mosley
Bradley
Marquez I
Marquez II
Marquez III
Marquez IV
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  captainanddew on Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:17 am

Shaun wrote:16 fights vs top tier opposition... and counting.

Erik Morales
Erik Morales II
Erik Morales III
Barrera I
Barrera II
Oscar
Hatton
Cotto
Clottey
Margarito
Mosley
Bradley
Marquez I
Marquez II
Marquez III
Marquez IV

no. many hall of famers in the old days fought the best. some guys fought 5-6 times or more. hall of famers.

But when you look at the past 20 years, his list of opponents has been damn good when comparing it to this era.

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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  Shaun on Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:24 am

true, perhaps I should change it to "best of his era"
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  Soonermark890 on Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:42 am

Shaun wrote:true, perhaps I should change it to "best of his era"
If you say best of his era then yes.

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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  hardcorebee24 on Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:58 am

No, not even close. Not his fault though as there isn't enough really great fighters this era has to offer.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  dbudge on Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:26 am

Sugar ray Robinson has the best resume of all time

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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  hardcorebee24 on Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:28 am

dbudge wrote:Sugar ray Robinson has the best resume of all time

Ali is up there too.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  SlickMoney on Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:37 am

Just in this generation, Oscar's is better. More prime fighters too.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  powerpuncher on Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:43 am

SlickMoney wrote:Just in this generation, Oscar's is better. More prime fighters too.
agreed. i think that he has a great resume for this generation but you have to also look at the quality of each opponent at the time they fought. for example, a fighter could hypothetically beat ten 50 year old HOFers but that doesnt mean much. so a lot of people on that list dont really count for much. again, i do believe he has a great resume though. just not the best necessarily.

of all time, no way. there are a ton of fighters that i could name off of the top of my head with better resumes back in the day. but thats not a fair comparison because boxing is different and its set up where you dont fight as much and once you get popular you just do 1 or 2 megafights a year instead of fighting every 2 months.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  dmar5143 on Sun Dec 09, 2012 10:23 am

good resume yes.the best no way..robinson greb gavilin and several others like charles in his prime etc etc overwelm pacs resume.one of the top 3 or so in the last 20 years.maybe.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  Soonermark890 on Sun Dec 09, 2012 11:41 am

SlickMoney wrote:Just in this generation, Oscar's is better. More prime fighters too.
Thats a good point. Only thing Pac has over Oscar is the 4 lineal titles.

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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  Diego408 on Sun Dec 09, 2012 2:21 pm

Its a good resume, but it falls short of many fighters in history. His best wins were the First Barrera fight, the second Morales fight, the second Marquez fight (bs decision), and the Cotto fight (catchweight fight). Pacquiao fought a lot of names, but most of those guys were not even real challenges when he fought them. Like he rematched Barrera after he lost to Marquez, also fought Morales in the third fight where everyone knew Morales couldnt keep up. David Diaz? instead of the third Marquez fight. An old DLH, old Mosley and old Margarito? Arum put Manny with a lot of names, but usually with no real challenges. Looking at his resume, it looks very strong, but following his career, that wasnt really the case.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  boxinglawyer on Sun Dec 09, 2012 5:03 pm

I think Pacs is the best of his era by a wide margin. Only ODLH comes close, the missed matches by ODLH clinches it for me. Pac fought em all, beat em all, and challenged himself. Pac truly is a once in a life-time type of fighter.

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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  powerpuncher on Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:48 am

boxinglawyer wrote: I think Pacs is the best of his era by a wide margin. Only ODLH comes close, the missed matches by ODLH clinches it for me. Pac fought em all, beat em all, and challenged himself. Pac truly is a once in a life-time type of fighter.
like i said, i really try to be non bias when i talk about boxing. i feel like pac's good guy persona has everyone only seeing his best qualities. on the flip side, thats why everybody only sees mayweathers bad qualities.

i do think that pac has a good resume. but as diego said, most of his wins werent necessarily that impressive. media made it look more impressive than they were. he definitely had a few impressive wins though and wins against fighters that i thought for sure he would lose. so i give him a ton of credit. my problem is that people fail to mention that although he moved up weight quickly, he pretty much skipped lightweight and light welter. he jumped to welter to fight de la hoya who had to weight drain himself to get down there. great match making, not necessarily a great win.

the one duck that nobody talks about though is the mosley duck. mosley said that he would fight him at whatever weight he wanted. he gave in to all of the demands (this was before the cotto fight). roach even said that mosley was too good at the time. i said at the time that mosley would beat pac which is why they ducked him. it was blatant. im just stating this to show that pac didnt just go through weight classes and fight the best. he jumped over weight classes to fight certain big named fighters that he was confident that he could beat. when other fighters do this (like floyd) we call them duckers.

so he has a great resume and has some great wins, but since certain people just like him so much they are so biased that they only see the good in his career and fail to see the whole picture.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  boxinglawyer on Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:44 am

powerpuncher wrote:
boxinglawyer wrote: I think Pacs is the best of his era by a wide margin. Only ODLH comes close, the missed matches by ODLH clinches it for me. Pac fought em all, beat em all, and challenged himself. Pac truly is a once in a life-time type of fighter.
like i said, i really try to be non bias when i talk about boxing. i feel like pac's good guy persona has everyone only seeing his best qualities. on the flip side, thats why everybody only sees mayweathers bad qualities.

i do think that pac has a good resume. but as diego said, most of his wins werent necessarily that impressive. media made it look more impressive than they were. he definitely had a few impressive wins though and wins against fighters that i thought for sure he would lose. so i give him a ton of credit. my problem is that people fail to mention that although he moved up weight quickly, he pretty much skipped lightweight and light welter. he jumped to welter to fight de la hoya who had to weight drain himself to get down there. great match making, not necessarily a great win.

the one duck that nobody talks about though is the mosley duck. mosley said that he would fight him at whatever weight he wanted. he gave in to all of the demands (this was before the cotto fight). roach even said that mosley was too good at the time. i said at the time that mosley would beat pac which is why they ducked him. it was blatant. im just stating this to show that pac didnt just go through weight classes and fight the best. he jumped over weight classes to fight certain big named fighters that he was confident that he could beat. when other fighters do this (like floyd) we call them duckers.

so he has a great resume and has some great wins, but since certain people just like him so much they are so biased that they only see the good in his career and fail to see the whole picture.

Roach was right. They were NOT comfortable at the weight yet. Pac was not like Mayweather in the regard that May was CUTTING weight since he started fighting and Pac was ADDING weight. Its not a fair comparison or expectation. That would be like criticising RJJ for jumping over Vassily Jirov to fight Ruiz in preparation to fight Lewis.
People have completley lost sight of what makes Pac so special. This sport is over a hundred years old with tens of thousands of participants and NOBODY has EVER done what Pac has!! It is amazing almost beyond description. That he has done it wo well is what makes people forget this was a 105 lb starving kid that hit the ring to eat, and became a wrecking ball across eight divsions (well, 6 at least Smile

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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  powerpuncher on Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:19 am

the weight jump has been exagerrated though because pac started his career so young. he was small and got bigger naturally because of age. i say that the interesting thing about pac is that he actually had more success fighting bigger fighters because of how well his speed and power moved up with him. he didnt dominate as much with the smaller guys because they were faster and could nullify to an extent pacs strengths.

at the higher weights, he was too fast and hit very hard so he could dominate opponents. that is why pac never fought any fighter known for their speed at higher weight classses. except mosley but he was way past his best. and him ducking mosley had nothing to do with the weight but had to do fighting a harder fight. mosley said he would fight at 140 and pac chose to fight cotto (the naturally bigger guy) at 140. it was the fact that it was a dangerous fight so they didnt take it.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  koolkc107 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:38 am

I figure Floyd's should be posted just as a way to compare(titles are for all weight classes the fighter fought in order to show they were champions of some sort)...

M. Cotto – Future HOF
V. Ortiz- WBC
S. Mosley- Future HOF
JMM- Future HOF
R. Hatton- Ring, WBA(2), IBF, IBO,
DLH- Future HOF
C. Baldomir- Ring, WBC
Z. Judah- 5 Titles, including Undisputed Welter
S. Mitchell- WBA, IBF
A. Gatti- IBF, WBC
D. Corley- WBO
JLC- Future HOF
J. Chavez- WBC, IBF
C. Hernandez- IBF
D. Corrales- Future HOF
G. Vargas- WBC
G. Hernandez- WBA, WBC
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  dmar5143 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:43 am

dispite all the ducking by phoney retirement or excuses floyd yes indeed has a very good resume.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  koolkc107 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:55 am

dmar5143 wrote:dispite all the ducking by phoney retirement or excuses floyd yes indeed has a very good resume.

Ducking? Maybe.

But, I make little distinction avoiding a fight or two and cherry picking and/or playing weight games multiple times. Both are not what you'd like to see in an ideal situation, yet both are what we see ALL the time from more fighters than can be named.

I agree, it doesn't mean a guy isn't great.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  boxinglawyer on Mon Dec 10, 2012 9:55 pm

powerpuncher wrote:the weight jump has been exagerrated though because pac started his career so young. he was small and got bigger naturally because of age. i say that the interesting thing about pac is that he actually had more success fighting bigger fighters because of how well his speed and power moved up with him. he didnt dominate as much with the smaller guys because they were faster and could nullify to an extent pacs strengths.

at the higher weights, he was too fast and hit very hard so he could dominate opponents. that is why pac never fought any fighter known for their speed at higher weight classses. except mosley but he was way past his best. and him ducking mosley had nothing to do with the weight but had to do fighting a harder fight. mosley said he would fight at 140 and pac chose to fight cotto (the naturally bigger guy) at 140. it was the fact that it was a dangerous fight so they didnt take it.

How is it exaggerated?!?!?! he weighed 105 pounds and made it up to championships at 154 pounds!! I dont care if he started at age 8! Again, in over a HUNDRED YEARS, tens of thousands of participants, NOBODY EVER DID IT BEFORE. We will all die and be dust before anyone else does again. Read it twice, then again. However long it takes to soak in. You are talking to a guy who actually SAW fighters you have only seen in grainy black and white film. Pac is a once in a lifetime fighter. You will NEVER see anyone like him again. EVER. enjoy it while it lasts if it isnt over already.

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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  dmar5143 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:11 pm

BL i agree on pacs career with you.lets not forget that carpentier also started as a flyweight then won the real lighheavy belt not a abc one and fought the great dempsey for the hw title.he fought in all 8 original divsions..
will we see what pac has done again.maybe in a 1000 years maybe.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  Soonermark890 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:15 pm

koolkc107 wrote:
dmar5143 wrote:dispite all the ducking by phoney retirement or excuses floyd yes indeed has a very good resume.

Ducking? Maybe.

But, I make little distinction avoiding a fight or two and cherry picking and/or playing weight games multiple times. Both are not what you'd like to see in an ideal situation, yet both are what we see ALL the time from more fighters than can be named.

I agree, it doesn't mean a guy isn't great.
Its not a maybe. He is a ducker. Retired? LOL

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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  flapanther2001 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:39 pm

boxinglawyer wrote: I think Pacs is the best of his era by a wide margin. Only ODLH comes close, the missed matches by ODLH clinches it for me. Pac fought em all, beat em all, and challenged himself. Pac truly is a once in a life-time type of fighter.
Agree 100%
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  powerpuncher on Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:47 am

boxinglawyer wrote:
powerpuncher wrote:the weight jump has been exagerrated though because pac started his career so young. he was small and got bigger naturally because of age. i say that the interesting thing about pac is that he actually had more success fighting bigger fighters because of how well his speed and power moved up with him. he didnt dominate as much with the smaller guys because they were faster and could nullify to an extent pacs strengths.

at the higher weights, he was too fast and hit very hard so he could dominate opponents. that is why pac never fought any fighter known for their speed at higher weight classses. except mosley but he was way past his best. and him ducking mosley had nothing to do with the weight but had to do fighting a harder fight. mosley said he would fight at 140 and pac chose to fight cotto (the naturally bigger guy) at 140. it was the fact that it was a dangerous fight so they didnt take it.

How is it exaggerated?!?!?! he weighed 105 pounds and made it up to championships at 154 pounds!! I dont care if he started at age 8! Again, in over a HUNDRED YEARS, tens of thousands of participants, NOBODY EVER DID IT BEFORE. We will all die and be dust before anyone else does again. Read it twice, then again. However long it takes to soak in. You are talking to a guy who actually SAW fighters you have only seen in grainy black and white film. Pac is a once in a lifetime fighter. You will NEVER see anyone like him again. EVER. enjoy it while it lasts if it isnt over already.
because he was 16 when he was that small. mayweather was the same weight when he was 16 but nobody talks about how he jumped up that many weight classes. pac just hit a later growth spurt than most people. again, its an interesting thing about pac because it is unusual but not a great as people make it sound.
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Re: Does Pacquiao have the best resume of all time?

Post  powerpuncher on Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:48 am

koolkc107 wrote:
dmar5143 wrote:dispite all the ducking by phoney retirement or excuses floyd yes indeed has a very good resume.

Ducking? Maybe.

But, I make little distinction avoiding a fight or two and cherry picking and/or playing weight games multiple times. Both are not what you'd like to see in an ideal situation, yet both are what we see ALL the time from more fighters than can be named.

I agree, it doesn't mean a guy isn't great.
agreed. both have solid resumes and i would say that mayweathers ducking status has been blown way out of proportion because of how much people hate him.
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